Spyhawk

Seems we got success earlier than expected with LuaSQL 

We'll likely write our own lightweight admin suite, since none of the existing projects fit our objectives for the Legacy mod. Would you be interested in participating in? It would have basics features only: Lua 5.3 only, LuaSQL db backend, adminlevel management, warn, kick, ban, mute, gib and ideally it would be modular and easily extensible for any future needs.

I'll let you know if we achieve something on the SQL side then.

Still no lighter version planned?

What about using real SQL database support?

Nobody's going to answer that. Taboo subject. But with spreading of ETL over the world I think the list will be fakeservers free 

Hopefully, yes. ET:L servers also differentiate humans and bots count, which might interest more than a few players.

And that leads to another question? If thats true And I coded the excact same code at et from scratch then they cannot claim copyright due to the fact I coded it from scratch?

So I would own my own version of "ET" as I would say and could basicly claim I wrote the code? This is what twists my mind because in that case I could copy a code and say I wrote it!?

It's possible by using a Clean room design, also known as "Chinese wall technique". Basically, a different team would implement the code based on specifications done by someone else that tried the original product.

In other words, legally speaking, if you ever looked at the original code, you're not able to implement that new code yourself.

Silent is based on the SDK code (like all other ETPub derived mods), and thus is not concerned by the GPL.

Nice addition indeed! Any improvement to the objective gameplay is going to be very appreciated

matchmaking is probably nessesary for ETlive anyway

Yes, but the ETLive guys don't work at all with the ET:Legacy team. It seems they even work on a new graphic renderer instead of contributing to the one that is currently developed by ET:L. This looks more like a complete fork developed behind closed door with a lot of wasted, duplicated efforts - so don't count too much on the ET:Live project.

I was specifically referring to the original TrueSkill PDF. The Moserware PDF is much easier to read.

As a first step, I'd like to implement only the TS algorithm as it is currently done with ETPub Player Rating, with features like winning probability and optional match balancing.

Later, match making might be implemented too, depending on the difficulty in doing so. Afaik, this would require some features in a reworked masterlist code, so this shouldn't be done in mods, but in an upgraded server infrastructure (such as what is planned with the ET:Legacy project).

there is no point in reading this unless you really know your statistics and propability mathematics

No necessarily. The MoserWare article you linked to introduces the needed basics in quite a simple way, unlike the original TrueSkill paper.

I don't think TrueSkill brings much to the table as the mostly similar ETPub PRW is already included, but it could be a nice addition for others mods. I've been working on implementing it for Legacy for some time now. The code is not finished yet but you can expect to see this in ET soon (most of the code is already written, but others stuff have higher priority right now).

On second thought, I think this is the way it should be as it takes under consideration only the real play time. Otherwise, if the player was not helping his team (by staying in limbo or spec) the PRW would not be reflecting the real situation.

At least, this behaviour should be consistent with dead players and players in limbo. Both a player that is waiting for a medic or a player that is forcefully sent to limbo contribute nothing to the gameplay, yet only the time of players in limbo isn't taken into account. This would also implies that players in limbo aren't part of a team, which doesn't really make sense.

This clearly seems to be an unwanted bug (see the return right above the mapAxisTime/mapAlliesTime computation). Beside this, the behavior isn't documented anywhere - nor in a comment in the code, nor anywhere in the documentation.

It's hard to evaluate how much this bug influence the PWR rating in average. Maybe by a few percent only, but this is still a systematic error.

Btw, I recently found a bug in the time played in each team values  in etpub (mapAxisTime / mapAlliesTime). It is not computed when players are in limbo, so the more a player spend in limbo, the less accurate these values are. Consequently, the PRW can't be accurate either. Chances are that this bug is still present in latest silent.

Thx, you are right gaoesa. I changed my last post (see the bold) - I was thinking about KR while I wrote PRW, my bad.

I'm personally not convinced that KR is accurate. It is still better than nothing, but it won't reflect action where many players are involved (ie, you're fighting an enemy, almost killed him, but a teammate will "finish" the kill). Only the victim and the player that makes the kill are taken into account.

 

 

All of the game revolves around kills afterall. Of course, both of these methods require that the teams are playing for the objective and try to win the map.

Not really - as you said, PRW is looking only at the outcome of a game while KR looks only to individual 1vs1 combat, so if you are the best killer on a server but a poor objective player, you might end up with a high KR, but a low PRW.

Isn't there something also about the skill level (probably PRW) of the player who is killing verses the player who is killed?  For example, if a really good player kills a noob, the change in the rating is minimal, whereas the noob killing the good player, the calculation favors this more?

 

I've noticed that in the spree stats for each map, there is rating variance and things like that that are stored.  I'm assuming this data is used in the calculation somewhere, which may explain why some people complain that KR is so weird on some servers and doesn't make sense?

Yes, ETPub's KR takes skill of killed player into account. Making "easy kills" on noobs won't improve your KR much, but killing a much better player than you will improve your KR much more.

KR is independent of PRW, and doesn't really make sense in a multiplayer game since it takes into account only the attacker and the victim, much like an independent 1vs1 game. But PRW is quite interesting imho. PRW also (optionally) takes the difficulty of the map into account.

If you're interested in knowing more, look for J.Menke's documentation: "A Bradley-Terry Artificial Neural Network Model for Individual